seventeenthnotes-deactivated201 asked: Hey! So I'm trying to convince myself to be vegan, but I'm in conflict with myself over the ethical issues. D'you think you could provide me with some good arguments and perhaps guilt me into going vegan? It's something I'd really like to do, I'm just having trouble completely winning myself over, if that makes sense. :D
oh definitely, every vegan’s dream haha! i could probably write a novel on this, but i have to leave for school in like ten minutes so i’m going to copy and paste from previous debates i’ve had with people and then leave you with a link to a speech by a vegan activist and if that doesn’t convince you, then … well, come back at me with more specific questions and i’ll tackle those directly for ya ;) but thanks for asking, i’m really glad you’re considering it and i’m sure you’ll find the motivation to make the change! it’s a lot easier than you’d think, there’s a huge variety of vegan foods and products out there.
so this first person got angry because i questioned why people care so much more about an abused dog than an abused pig, and we got on the topic of food …
“it’s just food and we shouldn’t judge each other on it. Eating or not eating meat and animal products does not determine whether you are a good or bad person.”
the way you stated this actually tells me a lot about the sort of person you are. it’s nicely stated, it’s polite, your grammar is good, it sounds very much like you’re petitioning for equal rights — from this i can deduce that you are perfectly capable of finding information and deciding things for yourself. you’re not just ignorant, the way many carnists are. you’re in denial. you don’t want to change, so you’ve convinced yourself that this is a battle between vegans and non-vegans, and that we’re all equal as humans and have our rights. yes. yes, that’s true. and if you wanted to live on jelly beans for th rest of your life, you know what?i wouldn’t care. i honestly have absolutely no cares about what you eat —unless it is harmful to others.
see, eating animal products isn’t just a personal choice. firstly, the animals are tortured and slaughtered — go youtube slaughterhouse videos to see what’s going on there, i don’t need to spell it out for you. then, the amount of methane gas they produce is the number one cause of pollution. their drug-contaminated waste gets into water supplies and poisons the fish and wildlife. 70% of the amazon jungle has been cleared for either land to grow feed for cattle or area for cattle to graze, all for human consumption. the amount of grain grown for cattle in the USA alone is enough to feed the world’s population three times over — bam, world hunger solved.
then there’s the health effects. it has been absolutely scientifically proven that meat and dairy consumption is the leading cause of heart disease and a huge contributing factor to other degenerative diseases such as diabetes and cancer. you know what the number one killer is right now? yup, heart disease. you know how much tax money goes towards health care? that’s right. you and i are paying for the people who indulged themselves to sickness because they were too selfish to give up one tiny little pleasure.
so does eating meat and dairy make you a bad person? well. what i’ve written here is an extremely abridged taste of the consequences of eating meat, but knowing this, if you elect not to do anything, if you elect not even to try making a change, not even try to get your facts straight, not even attempt to give up an unhealthy addiction to something that’s bad not only for you but for the whole planet, but to consciously decide you don’t care because you like the taste of meat — then yeah, you can bet my opinion of you is going to drop pretty damn low.
then there was the person who sent me this ask:
ps you need to stop with the herbivore bull, cause unless you have some scientific proof of it, you’re just coming off as a retard
so i replied
just for the record, i’m disappointed you asked this on anonymous. if we’re going to have a debate here you can at least give yourself the dignity of an identity, because if you don’t reply to this post i’m going to assume you have no counterargument.
i do have scientific proof. and i’ll break it down for you in just a second because first i want to point out that even if i didn’t have scientific proof, all you have to do is look around you. how many people do you know with a degenerative disease? heart disease? anyone had a stroke? diabetes? osteoporosis? asthma? bone fractures? cancer? anything? why do vitamin stores even exist? if in this meat and dairy eating society where the usda bullshits to your face that you get calcium and protein and all this stuff from dairy and meat, why can you walk into any pharmacy and find a shelf of calcium supplements? why are there people eating handfuls of pills for breakfast? and those people are not the vegans, trust me.
alright, on to the scientific proof about herbivores. i’ll make an abridged list of the main stuff so it’s easy for you to understand, because i could write a novel on this stuff but there are already plenty of books out there if you really want to educate yourself and aren’t just digging for nonexistent excuses to eat meat.
- intestines. humans, like all herbivores, have intestines 7-13 times the length of our torso. carnivores have intestines 3-6 times the length of their torso. this is so they can digest their food quickly and not clog their arteries with trans fatty acids. this is why people who eat meat and dairy will always have clogged arteries from trans fatty acids. this is why the number one killer of people is heart disease from clogged arteries. trans fatty acids are only found in animals. also, animals are the only source of cholesterol. your body makes its own cholesterol, and that is the only good cholesterol you can have. if you eat an animal product, you are automatically putting bad cholesterol into yourself. for the record, my cholesterol (as well as blood pressure and health overall) are absolutely perfect.
- our jaws go side to side, like all herbivores. carnivores’ and omnivores’ jaws only go up and down (try to get a dog or cat to grind its teeth from side to side — impossible). this is because we are meant to eat plants, chewing them well and slowly digesting, while cats and dogs are designed to bite and swallow, hence why dogs eat much faster than a person. and before you nag about our canine teeth, ALL herbivores have canine teeth (i’ve stuck my fingers in enough horses’ mouths to know that firsthand. i know horses so i usually use them as my “okay we know for sure that’s an herbivore” comparison. here is a diagram of a horse’s mouth. look in a mirror and compare to your own). they are blunter than a carnivore’s because they are designed for gripping and biting into things like apples, not flesh (if you’ve ever bitten into a raw, whole chicken, you’ll find you have a lot of trouble tearing a chunk off).
- we have zero carnivorous instinct. we cannot track down an animal, catch it, and eat it without cheating and using weapons or traps. we don’t have claws, the trademark of all carnivores and omnivores. to paraphrase my hero gary yourofsky, if you put a kid in a crib, give it a bunny rabbit and an apple, and the kid eats the bunny rabbit and plays with the apple, i will revoke everything i’ve said and agree that humans are born carnivores. until that happens, we will remain herbivores. but put a young tiger in a crib with a bunny and an apple and i’m pretty sure we all know which it would eat and which it would bat around with a paw.
- our bodies can’t process animals. let’s go back to my original example of calcium. milk’s got calcium, yeah? well, it also has casein protein, better known as animal protein. the meat and dairy companies have lied to your face and told you this stuff is good for you, but actually, the human body has no use whatsoever for animal protein. there are lots of bad things about it that you can look up, but let’s relate it to calcuim for the moment. casein protein is too acidic for us. the moment it enters out bodies, it turns our blood acidic. now obviously the human body can’t survive with acidic blood, so immediately the body has to figure out how to negate the acidity. luckily, human bodies are pretty smart and they’ve figured out how to do this, but the way they do it is by using phosphate. the only source of phosphate in the body is bones, which are a combination of phosphate and calcium. so the body takes calcium phosphate from the bones, uses the phosphate to negate the acidity, and then we pee out the excess calcium, so drinking milk will literally leach the calcium from your bones. and so, osteoporosis, bone fractures, calcium supplements. i could go on about medical stuff but you might as well get a copy of the china study and hear it straight from the professionals.
if you can provide scientific proof that people need meat and dairy, let me know. i’m honestly curious why you’re so defensive, and let’s face it, outright hostile about my point of view (calling someone a retard before you’ve even heard what they have to say is pretty rude, you know)
also, since i’ve talked about dairy quite a bit in this post, here’s an interesting fact for you: one cubic centimeter of cow’s milk is legally allowed to have 750,000 somatic cells in it. do you know what that means? i’d be surprised if you did, considering, well, the message you sent me. somatic cells is the fancy way of saying pus, which gets in the milk because the machines milking the cows cause infections and don’t know the difference between milk and pus. this amount is about an eye dropper full of cow pus per glass of milk, and that’s not even mentioning the antibiotics and hormones that get mixed in. sure, milk is pasteurized, but that just means the pus gets sanitized, not removed. you’re drinking sanitary pus. melting it on your pizza. mixing it into you salads. drinking it with your coffee. sound healthy? sound pleasant?
so my questions for you are, why are you convinced veganism is wrong? do you know where your meat and dairy come from? do you even know why cows make milk or why chickens lay eggs? do you know what is in these products and what they do to your body? do you know what the animals go through in order for you to enjoy their body parts?
any more questions for me? please, feel free to ask. i’m happy to spread awareness and help people see beyond the baldfaced lies that the meat and dairy companies have brainwashed the population with.
they never answered my questions.
but the most powerful message is in videos. here is the speech by gary yourofsky that i recommend. if you want behind-the-scenes footage of the horror that goes on behind factory walls, you can go to youtube or watch the documentary Earthlings. there are also youtube videos on people affected by the animal industries. there are great books out there like The China Study and Born To Run that can give you insight into different benefits of a vegan diet. basically there are a TON of resources out there to get you started, and you’ll have the support of every vegan everywhere and ever :)
so let me know if you have any more specific questions or concerns!